The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

ImageForum for news and discussions on miltary aviation matters.

Forum rules
Image
Post Reply
AK01
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 2470
Joined: 09 Sep 2006, 10:35

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by AK01 »

Richard from Rotterdam wrote:
AK01 wrote:
So it seems to me there are at least two N611AM B757's, one registered to L3 and stored , and another one flying around with AAL as late as jan2013.

Anyone who can tell me more about this one?? am i missing something here, or are they trying to fool us?
Why did they cover the AA logo at Roswell, and painted the lower cheatline (standard in red) in a dark-blue paint.
It might just be that the date stamps on airliners.net are not correct. FAA register can't really have two aircraft with the same registration at the same time I think.
Richard,
It was definetly active in 2012, see for instance http://www.berlin-aviation-forum.com/t4 ... kl-bahamas, last flight for N611AM was 22/04/2012, see http://www.b757.info/B757/cn/24487.htm.

So it's pretty obvious that there were two N611AM's at the same time.

Pilotman, N611AM is quoted as 24487 in FAA database, N903TB is quoted as 28172, N903TB has PW220 engine, N611AM has RB211, so also not a good alternative in my opinion.
Regards Pieter,
pilotman6012
Scramble Master
Scramble Master
Posts: 3497
Joined: 11 Aug 2012, 18:51
Type of spotter: Military
Subscriber Scramble: No
Location: Huntsville,Alabama

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by pilotman6012 »

I meant it was it's replacement since N611AM was withdrawn from service,N903TB was to take it's place in rotation.Which it appears so now since it has been in Greenville for at least 6 weeks.
Thanks!
Pro-163,Pro-197,Psr-400,Pro-2052,BCD996XT,BCD996P2
User avatar
Richard from Rotterdam
Scramble Master
Scramble Master
Posts: 2679
Joined: 09 Aug 2004, 12:38

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Richard from Rotterdam »

Pieter, when you look at the curet FAA registry entry for N611AM you'll find:
Serial Number 24487
Status Valid
Manufacturer Name BOEING
Certificate Issue Date 09/11/2012
Model 757-223
Expiration Date 09/30/2015
Type Aircraft Fixed Wing Multi-Engine
Type Engine Turbo-fan
Pending Number Change None
Dealer No
Date Change Authorized None
Mode S Code (base 8 / oct) 51771201
MFR Year 1989 Mode S Code (base 16 / hex) A7F281
Type Registration Corporation
Fractional Owner NO
Registered Owner
Name L-3 COMMUNICATIONS ADVANCED AVIATION LLC
Street 33 S LAST CHANCE GULCH

City HELENA State MONTANA
County LEWIS AND CLARK Zip Code 59601-4119
Country UNITED STATES
Airworthiness
Engine Manufacturer ROLLS-ROYC Classification Standard
Engine Model RB.211 SERIES Category Transport
A/W Date 07/17/1989
As far as I can tell from online records the American Airlines N611AM has the same msn as this one. Possibility might be that the "live" AA N611AM was already sold to L3 prior to being taken out of service? That seems the only logical explanation to me.
User avatar
ErwinS
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 2147
Joined: 09 Mar 2005, 12:34
Subscriber Scramble: ErwinS

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by ErwinS »

The shots at A.net of N611AM taken Jan 12-2013 are incorrect. See the fleetnumber on her nose gear door. She is in fact N195AN.

So the lateste in svc shot is http://www.airliners.net/photo/American ... 38421ac920
March 29 2012

She was std at ROW 23-04-2012
And afterwards she went to L-3;-)
AK01
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 2470
Joined: 09 Sep 2006, 10:35

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by AK01 »

Still leaves the picture of July 2011 when it was stored at Roswell, see http://www.flickr.com/photos/79988143@N02/8445150731/
American AL did the last flight in April 2012, so in 2011 there were at least two N611AM,s.
Regards Pieter,
User avatar
ErwinS
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 2147
Joined: 09 Mar 2005, 12:34
Subscriber Scramble: ErwinS

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by ErwinS »

AK01 wrote:Still leaves the picture of July 2011 when it was stored at Roswell, see http://www.flickr.com/photos/79988143@N02/8445150731/
American AL did the last flight in April 2012, so in 2011 there were at least two N611AM,s.
Regards Pieter,
Could well be temp storage. Nothing special about that in the airline biz. No way there were two N611AM'at the same time.
Or the date at flickr is wrong.
User avatar
Piet Luijken
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 3947
Joined: 27 Dec 2003, 14:19
Subscriber Scramble: Piet Luijken
Location: Amstelveen

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Piet Luijken »

Greetings,

Piet Luijken
Scramble Editor
User avatar
Bjorn van der Flier
Scramble Junior
Scramble Junior
Posts: 170
Joined: 18 Sep 2008, 20:24
Subscriber Scramble: Bjorn van der Flier

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Bjorn van der Flier »

Guys, sorry about all the confusion, but my picture at [img]http://www.flickr.com/photos/79988143@N02/8445150731/
[/img] was shot in July 2012, I'm very sorry for that slip of the finger on my side.
_________________
Bjorn van der Flier
User avatar
Le Addeur noir
Scramble Master
Scramble Master
Posts: 64760
Joined: 19 Jan 2007, 16:22
Subscriber Scramble: Nee
Location: Asie

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Le Addeur noir »

C-32B "99-6143" was visiting Leeming as CAMAY87 last week.

She used her known hex code AE0446 on this visit.

Has the MSN been established for this airplane?.
Drink treble
See double
Act single

and the Emir called up his jet fighters
User avatar
Gietje
Scramble Master
Scramble Master
Posts: 3404
Joined: 03 May 2009, 14:33
Type of spotter: If it's got wings and engines...
Subscriber Scramble: Gideon van Dijk
Location: Rotterdam

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Gietje »

Le Addeur noir wrote:C-32B "99-6143" was visiting Leeming as CAMAY87 last week.

She used her known hex code AE0446 on this visit.

Has the MSN been established for this airplane?.
According to the database of this very website, it is 25494/611.
Cheers,
Gideon
My photos at Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/39101604@N08/
User avatar
Le Addeur noir
Scramble Master
Scramble Master
Posts: 64760
Joined: 19 Jan 2007, 16:22
Subscriber Scramble: Nee
Location: Asie

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Le Addeur noir »

Airfleets has MSN 25494 as C-32B 00-9001.

As does this website.

So unless MSN25494 has two tail numbers and hex codes,that is wrong.
Drink treble
See double
Act single

and the Emir called up his jet fighters
hammarö
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 1591
Joined: 19 Jun 2012, 10:30
Type of spotter: I am not Dutch fluent.
Subscriber Scramble: hammarö

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by hammarö »

USAF Special Operations C-32 tailnumber 99-6143 callsign CAMAY 87 inbound Leeming for exercise Jaded Thunder.

2016.07.20

https://twitter.com/usafmonitor

ROWAN 73 00-9001 departed Stuttgart 2016.06.30 inbound 2016.06.28 from US.

https://twitter.com/usafmonitor

USAF Special Operations C-32 overhead Europe direct Middle East. Tailnumber 02-4452 with callsign PINTCH 78. 2016.05.25

SAM 44 C-32 09015 is following Air Force One and is now overhead Belgium direct the UK. 2016.04.21. Presidental meeting in Europe.

John Kerry is now overhead Holland in C-32A 99-0003 with SAM 895. Returning US after meeting with Putin in Moskva.
AK01
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 2470
Joined: 09 Sep 2006, 10:35

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by AK01 »

24452 at this moment over the UK descending into Prestwick. 96143 at the same time coasting in France/Bordeaux after crossing the Atlantic. So these are for sure different airframes.
Pieter,
User avatar
n5205e00421
Scramble Die-Hard
Scramble Die-Hard
Posts: 665
Joined: 08 Nov 2003, 23:45
Type of spotter: S3 & Mode-S
Subscriber Scramble: Y
Location: n5223e00593
Contact:

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by n5205e00421 »

If I may dust off an old thread...

I have gone through everything I could find about the C-32B’s on several forums, checked 200 pics and very helpful: I checked the last year of ModeS/ADS-B-flight history of all frames involved ( flight-data.adsbexchange.com ). Summarizing :

00-9001 and 02-4452, the ones with just a flag and a serial, operate out of mcGuire, and regulary fly together at the same time.
I suspect these two are the "real" FEST frames. Makes sense with one aircraft known to be paid for in the FY 2000 budget, and one in 2002. Most sources assume 00-9001 is c/n 25494 and 02-4452 is c/n 25493.

Just looking at the top of the fusulage they must be two different frames as the others, and they cannot be the same frame.
Some antennas were added during the life of these aircraft. They don't disappear again over time, and there are several pics of one aircraft with a new antenna where the other one is seen still without it:

Image

00-9001 got antenna #2 between 05/2006 and 11/2007, #1 early 2012, #3 late 2014, and #4 early 2017.
02-4452 got antenna #2 between 11/2005 and 06/2006, #1 and #3 mid 2013, and #4 between mid 2015 and early 2016.

The other 757/C-32B's lack #1, #2 and #4.

On 02-4452 the flag moved one window forward in 2013 (when it got antenna #1 and #3?), but it has moved back to its old position in 2015/2016.





The other three military aircraft, 02-5001, 98-6006 and 99-6143, carry a roundel and US AIR FORCE titles, operate out of Eglin, FL and.... so do the Comco aircraft N226G and N610G, both officially registered to L-3. As suggested by others, I am convinced the Comco aircraft are highly involved as also being these three C-32's, but who knows if another frame is also part of the story...

The flight history at adsbexchange looks pretty complete; a few flights may be missing but the flights almost always start and end around Eglin. The history of the last 12 months of the three Eglin-based C-32B's and both Comco aircraft can be flown with two airframes. However, this would involve regular changing between serials and sometimes liveries, varying from about once, to up to 5 changes in a month’s time. The required changes do fit in the schedule during a stop at Eglin.

For over a dozen flights where ADS-B data could be checked against a photo, ADS-B regs as known by adsbexchange (and Live Mil Mode-S) were correct for all frames (e.g. PlaneFinder follows only AE0442(00-9001) and AE0438, but has that hexcode listed as 98-6006 instead of 02-4452).

Now this is suspicious: On two occasions last year the hexcode changed in-flight from a Comco aircraft to a C32-serial and back!
This together with a change in FlightID and squawk so ATC must have noticed/been aware. Position, altitude and time are too close for another explanation:

On the 9th of November 2016, the hexcode temporarily swapped from N226G to 02-5001:
Image

And on the 8th of March 2017, the hexcode swapped between N226G and 99-6143:
Image
(the red dots start at 00:00 utc, the aircraft came from Opa Locka)






The two Comco aircraft differ externally by window count: like the two McGuire-frames, N226G always has 13 windows forward both sides, and 17 windows in the middle on the LH-side. N610G has 12 windows here (the 13th plugged), and 19 windows in the middle LH-side. Also, N610G has a fourth probe on the RH side of the nose, apparently an ice detector.

99-6143 with 17/13 windows, no ice-detector(like N226G):
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/7068734
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/8133460

..and with 19/12 windows and the ice detector(like N610G):
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/7612531
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/7477513


Some pics of 02-5001 with 17/13 windows, no ice-detector(like N226G):
https://www.flickr.com/photos/planephot ... Cj7-5hBaa7
https://www.flickr.com/photos/fisherbra ... Cj7-5hBaa7

..and with 19/12 windows and the ice detector(like N610G):
http://paineairport.com/images/kpae11206.png
http://paineairport.com/kpae11205.htm

The 17/13 and 19/12-configurations have changed back and forth several times with these serials.

98-6006 has only started showing up again from 2013, and I could only find pics with 19/12 windows and the ice detector, like N610G:
I could not find any pics of 98-6006 before 2013, and of 02-5001 before 2007, although both regs have been reported seen as early as 2000. Difficult to say if these were the same aircraft as today, or that the McGuire-frames were involved back then.



With increased contrast it becomes visible that the roundel is something like a square sticker below the 6,7 and 8th window counting back.
Image


Around 2015/2016 the Comco aircraft got a new colourscheme but previously you could just see a lighter area on the same spot as the sticker, covering the flag.
Image


The flag itself is at the exact same spot as the two McGuire-aircraft, making me wonder if that was a deliberate attempt to cause confusion with those aircraft, or if they might have been changed around in earlier times.

And with this tail in high contrast, is that COMCO wiped out?
Image
I could not recreate this with other pictures though.


We know C-32B’s can refuel in-flight:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0XVjOG7Ebg

This C-32B crew training document mentions training for air-to-air refuelling:
http://static.e-publishing.af.mil/produ ... c-3bv2.pdf

For most regs/serials, except 98-6006 and 02-5001 (just no good close-ups) but including the Comco's (civilian!?), I have found pics where the aerial refueling point seems visible. It is easier to spot on older pics.

00-9001:
http://www.airplane-pictures.net/photo/ ... ing-c-32b/
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6623542

02-4452:
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/5619622
http://www.airliners.net/photo/USA-Air- ... A/861099/L
http://www.airliners.net/photo/USA-Air- ... /2641651/L

99-6143:
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/8355009 (17/13w)

N226G:
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6396567
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6498732

N610G:
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/371489




My conclusion is that when 02-5001, 98-6006 or 99-6143 have 19/12 windows and the ice probe, it is probably N610G, and with 17/13 windows it is likely to be N226G in disguise.

It would be interesting to know more about N144DC though, also a RR-powered B757, ex NASA and now registered with L-3, like the two Comco-aircraft. No recent flight history or pics found...
N903TB is a different B757 registered with L-3, but that one has winglets and P&W engines instead of RR .

L.
Last edited by n5205e00421 on 08 Aug 2017, 15:48, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Melchior Timmers
Scramble Addict
Scramble Addict
Posts: 1589
Joined: 13 May 2006, 18:06
Subscriber Scramble: Melchior Timmers
Location: Soest
Contact:

Re: The 'black' USAF C-32Bs

Post by Melchior Timmers »

WoW, Thanks for your research, very nice to read and sounds very likely being the truth..
Melchior Timmers
Editor Scramble Magazine
-----------------------------------------
PO Box 75545
1118 ZN Schiphol
The Netherlands
E-mail: melchior.timmers@scramble.nl
Internet: http://www.scramble.nl" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Post Reply

Return to “Military Aviation News”